Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: We grew over 80% revenue last year and year over year from 22 to 23. And two thirds of that growth came from renewals.
[00:00:11] Speaker B: Yo, mic check. What's up, everybody? You're listening to the street pricing podcast, the only show where proven SaaS leaders share their mindset and mistakes in pricing. So we can all stop guessing and start growing. Enjoy way subscribe and tell a friend. Now, let's break it down with your host and sought after slayer of bad pricing, Marcos Rivera.
[00:00:33] Speaker C: What's up? And welcome to the Street Pricing podcast. I'm Marcos Rivera, author, founder and pricing coach. And today's guest is going to knock your socks off. She brings the energy every single time. And as a co founder and someone who's been in the trenches, I think we're gonna learn a ton. Today's guest is Kirsten Morfield. Kirsten, welcome to the show.
[00:00:55] Speaker A: Marcos. I am so excited to dig into the nerdy topic of pricing and packaging.
[00:01:01] Speaker C: We are going to get nerdy. It's going to be fun nerdy though, right? It's going to be fun nerdy. Take a couple of seconds, tell the audience a little about you and what you do. Sure.
[00:01:09] Speaker A: So, my name is Kirsten Morfield. I am a co founder of B Two B SaaS tech company called Cloverleaf. What we do is we take all those assessments you've taken in your past, your strength finder, your disc, your Myers Briggs, and we turn those into coaching. That is all done by a technology.
And we send short little coaching tips to people in the flow of their work. So in your calendar, your messaging apps, your email, and we tell you the most important information you need to know for you to thrive. So that's. That's a little bit about what we do. We're based in Cincinnati, Ohio. So anytime I talk startup stuff, I think it's a pretty interesting perspective because it's very different than being on the coast. And, yeah, proud of what we built. Excited to talk. Packaging.
[00:01:51] Speaker C: Oh, man, listen. And speaking of talking, I got to see you, a glimpse of you on that TED talk. And you were amazing. Just amazing. And I think for those listening, check her out. Just type in kirsten. Type in ted. You'll see it. Fantastic. Talk all around. And today we're going to step right in. Are you ready to get street with me? Are you ready? Okay, so here's what we're going to do. Quick roadmap for everybody. This show is based on the book street pricing. So we're going to follow the same format. We're going to start with rewind, which is, let's tell me a story about pricing. A pricing change, what you learned. We'll keep it relevant, we'll keep it juicy, and then we're going to bring it back to play, which is what's working today. And then we're going to talk a little bit about fast forward, which is, okay, the future, what's next, what's going to happen? And then at the end, I got my special question coming up, which is all about your favorite song. You ready to go?
[00:02:39] Speaker A: Ready to go? Let's do it.
[00:02:41] Speaker C: Super. All right. Tell me about a pricing story, something that you learned. A change. Let's hear it.
[00:02:46] Speaker A: There's a lot I could go to, but I will go to. Actually, Marcos, when we got in touch with you and we said, hey, we need some help with pricing, we are noticing some friction in our business. We think it comes down to a pricing problem. So at this point, we definitely had product market fit. We had honed a lot on who our buyer is, although we're even sharper today. I would say very early in the development of cloverleaf, we struck gold in discovering the unique value of our product. And then after that, we had so much friction in the go to market side of just explaining what it is, because there's nothing else like it, even the way I explained it today. You ask me in two months, I'll explain it different. We're always honing how we actually explain what we do because there's nothing else like it. And for better or worse, there's also no copycats yet, so we're still the lone wolf. Like, explaining it right. And then also with just the messaging challenge also comes once you actually get in contact with the right person. They just have so many questions, like, how does it actually work, and how do you prove the value, and how do you. Blah, blah, blah. And so we had all of this delay in getting to the right leads, but also then closing them right. And once they got on the platform, they would say, my God, this thing is life changing. Our people have never come to me so excited about a tool that I've ever rolled out to them. The engagement is the highest in any tool I've ever rolled out to them. I had no idea how powerful this is. And we were like, okay, that's why we feel like we need to fix this. Go to market side, right? And so we thought then we just need to create free trials. We need to give people a way to experience the magic of the product before they have to commit to a purchasing decision. So we went all in on PLG motions and we created a free trial and we did all that. And that honestly didn't work for us either. Because when the magic really happens is not when you have four people for two weeks poking around, it's when you have 500 people, 2000 people on and you can look up everyone you work with and whatever meeting you're preparing for, there's coaching sent right to you about those people. And so we just honestly were feeling very stuck. Like we need to make our free trial a different time span. Do we need to make the product cheaper to just get more people on? What is really the best way to overcome this friction? And we were very convinced it had to do with either pricing, packaging, or some way of just giving away the experience for free.
[00:05:20] Speaker C: That is so profound. I mean, a couple of things here is when you think about, especially the more innovative startups that are out there, or new products, the customer themselves don't even know how to understand the value. And you're tuning, like you said, honing, just making sure, like, all right, we're hitting on these right different strings, but at the end it really comes down to low friction. And how do we make them taste the magic without a ton of work or habit changes or anything that people are naturally averse to change. And so it makes it really tough. And the first route people go is let's just give it to them for free. Let's just go just get it. Usually that's not always the answer, actually, because sometimes you need other things to come into play. You need either a certain level of critical mass or you need something else to pull in, a certain integration, whatever that is. That may take a little bit of friction or time. And that's the key element here. Keep going. Because I think a lot of folks felt the way you felt before.
[00:06:15] Speaker A: I'll stick on why free didn't actually work well for us. And I think the free trial part of the problem was just what's the right length of time? But another thing is when we get to the right buyer, we call them people strategy leaders. They're very niche, they're talent leaders, or learning and development leaders.
Their whole job is to put on programs and they have no roi of those programs. There's so much friction in them putting them on, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. The way that our product works, it solves all of those problems for them and gives them data and roi and things they never had before. And what the magic in our product is, is when they can actually integrate that into one of their programs, if we can just get it into their one leadership and development program they're doing now, or their one onboarding of new hires where they have them all take disk. Anyway, if we could just get it into one of those, that's where the product naturally just spreads to all of the right people.
The end users have the right pain that it solves as well as the buyer has the right pain that it solves. And so if we just made it free, people are like, if I have time, I'll get to it, type of a thing. We needed to actually have the customer have some skin in the game and the right support to get it implemented into a program, which that in and of itself doesn't take a lot of friction, but it's different than a free trial. And so, you know, we knew all of this. We came to you, Marcos, and we said, help us out. Like, do we need to have different tiers in our packaging? Do we need to make this less expensive? What do we need to do? And really what it came down to is we needed to package it different, but not in terms of your premium, your pro, and your enterprise packaging, but in the way that we contract it. So at the end of last year, at the end of 2022, we said to our whole company, we are going all in on GFE. GFE is the way GFE is. Good faith estimates. And so also, just side note, it's so funny to be at this stage of business where we start implementing acronyms. I used to always make fun of businesses with all their acronyms, and now I'm like, we sell via GFE to our, you know, it's like acronyms everywhere. So we went all in after working with you, and also we got connected to a really awesome mentor at Slack. And this is the way that Slack does their sales, too. And the way that this way of contracting works is you just get to the buyer and you say, hey, this is a new thing. Totally get it. What we're going to do is we're going to sell you 100 seats, and it's $12 per user per month. We'll tier packaging as it grows. But let's just start out with 100. You choose the 100, get it in a program. We'll start it with those guys, and for six months, that's what you're going to pay. So it comes out to. I can't actually do the math on that. It's like $7,200 a month for six months.
And then what we'll do is it's just free to everyone above that hundred in that time span. Like open invitations to whoever wants to join. So let's say they implement it into their onboarding program. Their new onboarding folks, new hires are taking disk as they get in, and then they're able to just invite in their entire team that they're now about to work with. So every 100 of those people just pretty naturally goes out and invites in five more people. And then those five people, now we're at 500. They really are like, this is amazing. And now my whole marketing team is on here, but I need help with this salesperson that I work with, who I always have friction with. So I'm going to go invite in that salesperson. Then that salesperson is like, well, where's the rest of my team? And it just naturally organically grows, but they're not paying for that 500 extra that just got invited in and then that 1000 extra that gets invited in after that. And so we just built this business case over that first six months of look at how much this just took off like wildfire, and look at how engaged people are in the app and we take all the data to them, right? And then they're like, hot damn, I've never seen something like this before. And then we get into like, okay, now six months you're going to have to pay for all these people, but also we'll tier pricing and blah, blah, blah. And you get into all the art.
[00:10:40] Speaker C: Of negotiation, then you just hit on. So this is fantastic. And the reason why is because when people are thinking, well, gee, how do I get this in the customers hands? How do I get them to love it, to like it? They think free automatically. Maybe they think that the fear is to pick it up and adopt it, to start using it and tinkering with it. That's actually not where the real fear is, especially in b to b. The real fear is, holy crap, what if people start using this thing and then expense side blows up? And now I'm going to be sitting here trying to explain to my boss or my committee or the board why I got to spend all this other money, or I got the other bad news, which I got to take this away to keep me on their budget, and now I look like a villain. So either way, do I look like an idiot or do I look like a villain? And it doesn't put them in a good spot, right?
[00:11:23] Speaker A: We had this huge problem of like, we would get into an organization with some buyer and they couldn't expand it. They didn't have the right budget. And so we would be in this large enterprise with seven different accounts. Within that enterprise, billing was a pain, and none of them were like, oh, yeah, you could grow this beyond my team. They were like, no, I don't have the budget. They totally had that pain. And we were like, just get us to your people strategy leader above you. We'll help. But then we always had that friction in getting to that people strategy leader, too. So that's why this new packaging just completely flipped, all of that on its head. And another fear that our buyers had to your point of, like, it's so critical to take their fears into consideration in your packaging, right. And one of the fears they had is like, what if it doesn't work? What if people don't like it? And we said, no problem. You'll see the 100 people won't use it and it will never expand and you can cancel it. It's almost like it's such low risk. We just tried to take away all the risks they feared and also make it something where they have to have some monetary skin in the game. So they actually try. Right. But also very low budget for what they're doing, and we tie it into a cost savings for them as well. So, for example, the onboarding program where they use disk, our solution is cheaper than them just buying disk for everyone anyway. Right. So there's just tricks all along the route. But I like how you honed in on, when you think about pricing, what are the fear points of your buyer and really intimately understanding those so you can speak to those and you can design for those.
[00:13:00] Speaker C: Absolutely. You're hitting on a bigger or broader theme of psychological safety. Okay. And these people are putting their neck out there.
They're not nice and warm in our turtlenecks like we have today. Right. They're putting it out there bare and ready to get chopped. If this thing is a disaster, it could make them look bad for the next promotion, whatever that is. So what you did in that model, in the GFE is you said, look, we are going to contain the risk. We're going to put it right here in front of you. But listen, our stuff brings a lot of value, so you're going to pay, all right? But we want to make sure that you're not scared to use more of it. And we want to make sure that if it's successful, that we have a good basis to then talk about what a future arrangement looks like. And if it's not successful, that you've contained the risk and you didn't blow your whole career or your next promotion on this thing. Right? And I want to talk a little bit about box actually did something similar with their latest AI rollout. Is they said, look, use the AI. We're going to give you 20 credits that contains the risk. But if you need more, what they did was similar to yours, but they are starting to monetize it because they tested it out for some time. Is they said, look, we have an overage pool, if you will, for all of your users that are using the AI. And if they go over, you don't have to pay these obnoxious overage fees, which I think finally, I think it's time to start thinking about overage fees these days in monetization overall. But you don't have to pay these obnoxious overage fees. Just dip into the pool. And so it's almost like they built in the buffer in the model for the AI and it's been taken off like crazy. So your model for those that are thinking about, geez, how do we get friction down? How do we get people to want to adopt our new tool, our new product without being so freaking scared is to contain that risk and make it easy for them to go and let it blow up, let it spread, let people use it, especially for products that really rely on network effects, where it just gets more and more valuable the more people that use it. Definitely a technique to consider what happens to keep going. It's working today, right? And you rolled it out. Have you seen anything material in terms of your either close rates, conversion rates, anything like that that you can share?
[00:15:11] Speaker A: So it was our big bet last year that we did. So we got a year under our belt. I got all kinds of data I can share. Time to close went down all of those numbers on. So when we talk about our funnel, we actually talk about it like a bow tie because we have our left side of the funnel, which is like your awareness, your consideration, your selection, right. All the way to purchase. And then we expect it to just like the funnel actually just grows again on the other side, on the left side of our bow tie or on the right side. I mean, and so what we've seen is both of those get fatter, basically. So we are closing faster and we're closing with larger contracts, but those contracts aren't like significantly larger. It went from like 5000 to 10,000. You know what I mean? It's not like huge bump because that's not where our effort is actually focused. Where our effort is focused is on the right side of the bow tie, which is that growth that comes after. And that's really where we saw the differential. So every new logo that we got last year, we put them on a six month contract because we wanted to see within the year what happens, what happens at renewal. And what happened was fantastic. And it was actually so great to celebrate at the end of last year because last year was a hard year for SAS, and it was especially a hard year for our buyers for selling into HR and enterprise. Right? And we're pretty niche within HR, too, which people say the niches are in the riches, but whenever you talk to an investor, they're like, ooh, I don't know about that buyer. What are you going to do in a downturn? Like, you're a nice to have, not a need to have. And I think that this is. I'll give you some data in a second. But last year was a downturn, 2020 was a downturn in both of those. We grew. Our growth actually accelerated in both of those downturns. And I think there's a lot of reasons why it happened in 2020 and 21. But last year specifically, I credit all of it to this packaging, because once people could get in and experience the product, they see the magic. So last year, when the average growth revenue growth of a SaaS company was 8%, that was the average private SaaS company growth last year. And that's across SaaS. I'm sure in HR tech it's even harder. I mean, our investors talked to us about a lot of companies that are closing down right now. And our market, how hard our market is, right? Average growth is 8%. We grew over 80% revenue last year and year over year from 22 to 23. And two thirds of that growth came from renewals. And some of those renewals were new logos last year as well, right? Because it was a six month time span from new logo to renewal. So two thirds of that growth was in renewal, which means it was working like being able to just faster, get people in faster and then let it expand, let it grow and then be there ready for renewal, which obviously this takes a ton of coordination. It takes coordination from marketing to sales to CS product plays a huge role in it. Like how we watch our onboarding metrics, our engagement metrics, all of that. But we rallied the whole company around it. And as those numbers show, it totally paid off for us.
[00:18:22] Speaker C: That is phenomenal. Ten times the average rate, 8% to 80%. And your low friction model is what's really doing the trick. Because if you would have came in and said, yeah, you got to pay for 5000 users and here you go and here's your big o fat price point. I think you're going to get a lot of resistance, right? You're going to get the pushback.
[00:18:41] Speaker A: And we sell to enterprise and we sell to conservative buyers in enterprise. So the average sales cycle is like three years. But we were able to get over so much of that in flipping this model. And we even had customers who we'd been in a year long conversation and they were like, we're waiting to hear back from it on procurement and we got to build the business case. We had some of those customers who were just on lockdown, customers and prospects who were on lockdown. And we just brought in this new model to them and said like, hey, give this a shot, let's flip it. And then what was this frictionful, stalled conversation just immediately flipped, closed faster, expanded fast, renewed.
[00:19:24] Speaker C: Well, I got to ask you the real question here. Is the sales team, were they bought in on this? Did you have to twist their arm or how did they jump into this? Because now you're telling them, hey, there's all this extra usage and value happening before we're able to kind of lock them in. So there's a bit of a patient game where it's like, hey, I can't monetize all this value right away. Did you get any pushback from product or sales? Particularly sales?
[00:19:46] Speaker A: I think two things are really important in this. So one, I had the intuition to think that this would work like four years ago. And I talked to our head of sales so many times, like, just make the first part cheap. Like just let them get in there and use it. And he was always like, and it was once we actually talked to you guys and talked to that person at Slack who was super helpful and just saw frameworks around it and people who'd gone before us who'd thought through, how do you structure this? How do you communicate this and how does this impact your commission? Which is my second point for the sales team, for this to work well for the sales team, their commission is not just the first close that doesn't work, right. Because then one, they're not incentivized to set it up well for growth, right? Like they're just incentivized to get bodies in the door. But this aligned their incentives with our customer success incentives and our product incentives and it lets them win all around, right? So yes, their first closes and their commission on those first closes, it's lower, but they're closing faster, so they're able to get more of them and there's more to come after that as long as they can set things up well and they're not as involved in the renewal, but they are still involved. There's still a relational aspect, they're still helping with contracting, that kind of a thing. But at that point also, CS customer success has a huge role to play in that as well.
[00:21:21] Speaker C: I love it because obviously they get juice for the land because that's where things start, right? You got to have that first. But then they also get some play in that expansion piece. And so they're thinking, and we know how sales operates, right? It's like, hey, we got to make sure that you give them the right incentives, but that expansion piece of the comp also allows them to set it up for success. Let cs come in, let that growth happen. And so in that six month time frame or in that renewal period, you don't have to share if you don't want to. But I want to hear like, your success rate in renewal must be pretty damn good.
[00:21:51] Speaker A: What do you mean, like in the renewal?
[00:21:53] Speaker C: Yes.
[00:21:54] Speaker A: Oh, we have zero. Like, that's not even an exaggeration. It's zero.
I'm really glad you brought up churn because Churn is a key part of this learning as well for us. So I mentioned that to go into a GFE contract you have to start with 100. That's a minimum. Because we had seen in our churn, our accounts that have less than 100 people are the most likely to churn. So it has to start above that. That is just like minimum requirements, which also we do best in organizations that are 1000 or more employees in the mid marketed enterprise. And so it had to have a ten x growth potential with it as well. So we learned from the pain of churn we had over the years prior and structured how we do GSE to only accept what we knew would be the most successful. And yes, Marcos, it is not an exaggeration. It's not even 1%. Like we have had zero customers churn on this structure. We have.
[00:23:02] Speaker C: Oh my. I could tell you a ton of founders and SaaS leaders who would love to trade places with you right now and have zero churn. That's crazy. I would call BS on it, but I know the product. I've actually used it before and I believe it.
That's amazing.
[00:23:16] Speaker A: It's also something that it just doesn't exist. Nobody else is doing anything nearly like this. And so that's part of the pain. You've got to build trust. You got to get people to try it. You got to explain it to the market. And I would say, I would rate us a solid c minus on explaining to the market what we do, which is why we had to get inventive with packaging. Right? And once it's in though, to our buyer, the engagement rate in the product, they have nothing else like it. People say they want to learn and grow. They ask their leaders for better opportunities. But then when they're given a workshop, they're like, my gosh, I have to give a day to this. I don't have time for that. I'm going to get behind on my work. And we're just in the flow of work. And instead of it being some generalized learning that's available to everyone in the organization, this is based on your psychology. This is based on how you tick because you've taken assessments. This is based on the people around you who are causing you problems. You get to look them up. It's so different than anything else our buyer has, which is why they had fear, and that's why there was so much friction. And it's also why this packaging works so well, because it gives that time for that business case to build for them and for them to realize all the epiphanies that if you say to them, like, if I go and I say to you, Marcos, you've never experienced anything like this before, Marcos, your people are going to love this more than anything else you've given them. You're going to be like, I'm feeling a little bs that sounds a little too good to be it, really. I credit all of it back to that packaging. I mean, obviously, I credit so much of it to our product, but the product itself wasn't enough in the go to market motion. We had to get people to the product and the right structure.
[00:24:57] Speaker C: And you did that through building trust quickly by taking, addressing those fears, right, giving them the psychological safety they needed and making it easy to do more. And then again, once they taste it, once they start using it, once they actually see, because you have data now to show them, this is what's happening. This is not a theory. This is not a promise. This is happening. Let's go ahead and sign you up, right? Which I think major high fives all around on that piece. Give me the one like you learned a lot of lessons along the way, the aligning of sales, the positioning, all those key pieces, the contracting. What's the one big lesson you want to give anyone who has a phenomenal value, a product, and they need to get into the customer's hands and they're struggling. What's the one big takeaway?
[00:25:41] Speaker A: Oh, my gosh, that's hard.
Honestly, I think thematically, it's lean into all of the pain and friction and discomfort that there is for you that you feel on your go to market side, but also your customer. What are all of the things that you hear from them that they're worried about, scared of, and don't shy away from that. I think a lot of people shy away from it and just look for what everyone else is doing. Right. It was only because we really leaned into all of that that we were able to even face our churn rate and face the data on that. Just face all of the pain and the challenges, and there will be connecting points through that to what you need to do. And especially if you are in a new category, creating a category first to market, that is the only way you will succeed.
[00:26:31] Speaker C: You got to be bold. Lean into the pain. I love that piece. Phenomenal story for everybody, and I just think it has some incredible lessons all the way throughout. But let's bring it back to today here. What's working right now for you? I know, of course, the packaging structure is working. Is there something else that is really driving home results? What's happening now?
[00:26:48] Speaker A: I mean, I think another thing that really drives home results is just getting niche on who you're talking to. And that is something that our product can be used by anyone in the whole wide world, and it is valuable to anybody. But if we try to talk to everyone, it doesn't work that way. We had to get so crisp on who exactly has the budget and the right positioning in the organization to help this go organization wide. We thought it would be business leaders because they feel the business pain of all the people problems, like a department leader or something like that. And it's not because they then shut down the budget, right? Because I'm only going to pay for my organization, my department. So we really honed in on. It's that people, strategy, leader, they're in the right position. We save them money. We just built our sales thing around all, like, our sales points around that. And it allows us to speak to, even though there's a million pain points we could speak to for so many different people, it allows us to speak to their specific pain points, and that is how we land the best close, the best grow the best is when we have focused in on them. And we learned this through going to events we learned this through going to all the wrong conferences. We learned this through then discovering, like, okay, at these right conferences, when we have these right conversations, this is what happens. This is where our best leads are coming from. Our fastest closes, all that kind of stuff. And so really honing in on that. We're revamping our website to get better at that. But I think that trying to be one size fits all doesn't work. And this is generic. Any marketer will tell you this, but we're really leaning into that lesson now. Right niche down on your.
[00:28:36] Speaker C: You're right. And it can be a little bit of a cliche right around, but you're having the right conversations, and the right conversations means the right person and the right pain, and you're really honing in on that. The whole spray and pray thing doesn't really work out, doesn't really scale at the end of the day.
[00:28:55] Speaker A: I will say, though, controversial thing here. I think it helped us really discover where we belong, though, from a discovery.
[00:29:02] Speaker C: Yeah, I see your point.
[00:29:03] Speaker A: We got advice all along to niche down, and we were like, I don't know where yet.
I don't think that we did it wrong. Obviously, you always wish it could happen faster, but I think that is the change maker of 2024. If GFE was 2023, 2024 is focus on the right audience.
[00:29:23] Speaker C: I love it. And the early years led you to this, right? You wouldn't have known that's the right person or the right questions to ask or the right pain to get to unless you did all the work ahead of time to figure out where the wrong ones were, right. Having the wrong conversations to lead to the right conversations.
[00:29:38] Speaker A: And one other thing I'll say on that, too, Marcos, is this is also cross functional. So the actual implementation of leadership inside the organization is critical. If we hadn't really honed in, like, made an OKR for the company or a goal all about GFE last year, it would not have worked. If we hadn't aligned our leadership team, all of our different teams, to focusing on it, it wouldn't have worked. But because we made it a rallying cry without 30 other rallying cries, like, it was very focused effort that made all the difference. And it's the same thing this year. What we're telling our team is we're designing our category in the market. We're going after this one buyer, and we're niching down on these pain points. And that's like, we're going all in on that.
[00:30:23] Speaker C: I love it. And all in, like, underscoring all. That's everybody, every function, leadership, every level. This is what we're doing. Not 50 things. These things. Right. This one particular thing, I think that's something that gets overlooked quite a bit, especially in the early stages. And you are kind of reaping the benefits of that focus, I think, is what you're saying here, which I love, too. Now, moving into fast forward in the future, what's next? Are you thinking of something that you want to change or something that you might need to adjust in the packaging, the pricing, the model, anything like that?
[00:30:55] Speaker A: No, that's not to say that we shouldn't. That's not to say that we shouldn't.
[00:31:00] Speaker C: But keep it real. Keep it real. You like the way it is now? Yeah.
[00:31:04] Speaker A: I mean, the things that we're working on, we're definitely doing a lot of work on marketing. If you couldn't pick that up from what I was just talking about on the sales side, the things that we're working on are more around just our internal sales process. I think the actual pricing, packaging, all of that, it is working so well for us, so we're just improving how we are operating around that to get it to happen more and more and more.
[00:31:28] Speaker C: I love it. Just the envelope around all the pricing and packaging and making sure that the system itself is working well. I love that. Okay. You know what? I would say I could write half a book with everything you just said here.
In our time together, if you think about the psychological safety, the building of trust, the way you change, the contracting, the way you align sales, the way you align the organization, the way you get honed in on who you're after, I think these are things that take real work and take real time, but you have to keep at it. You have to keep hitting it with the hammer in order to crack it and make it work for you. So, Kirsten, I want to thank you for coming in and dropping some serious knowledge bombs for the audience. But I do have to ask you my favorite question now, which is, what's your favorite song? Give it to me. What do you love to listen to, Marcos?
[00:32:16] Speaker A: I listen to everything. I used to want to be an opera singer, so I listen to everything. I love McLemore. I'm a huge fan of him and his whole life. I like a broad variety. I would say. I have a playlist I go to when I'm having a hard day. And if you couldn't pick it up from lean into the pain, I am one who is for leaning into the pain and just do the best you can. So one of the songs that really helps to flip me. Well, I'll give you two. One is Andy Grammars. Working on it. It's just peppy, it's fun. It's a great beat. And it's like, hey, we're all just working on, like, you're doing the best you can. You're working on it. And I'm like, I am.
And I also love this is kind of a little bit old titanium by Sia and what's his dj? Yeah, electronic dance.
And it's a little bit like, you can't bring me it. Just both of those just kind of help pep me up. I love a good beat. Marcos, what about you, though? I need to know your favorite song.
[00:33:18] Speaker C: No, titanium is actually up there. I love that build up. Like the build up that David does in the whole song, obviously. See, as an amazing singer, I go back to hip hop in the 90s. My biggest one is notorious B-I-G. He's always been my favorite growing up. Not because he's from New York, just because I just thought his storytelling and flow was just ahead of his time, if you ask me. Right. And I'll go with juicy on that one.
One of my top me.
Listen to it. Have a lot of fun. Team, please. If you take anything away from this, do not be afraid of leaning into that pain, leaning into what your real value is, giving it to them. Let them taste it before you capture it and then build a system alignment and focus around it so you get a ton better. All right.
[00:34:02] Speaker A: Amen.
[00:34:03] Speaker C: So everybody here take these lessons home and continue to stop guessing and start start growing. Until next time, thank you and much.
[00:34:13] Speaker B: Love for listening to the street pricing podcast with Marcos Rivera. We hope you enjoyed this episode and don't forget to like and subscribe. If you want to learn more about capturing value, pick up a copy of street pricing on Amazon. Until next time.
